Declined [JB] Removing the CC Warning for Minigames (1 Viewer)

[LilSpaceMan]

Hey guys I'm here to state my cause and that I believe that we should remove the warning for collisions in minigames.


Why you ask?
For starters
1-Many players don't know about this rule resulting in unnecessary reports like one that was made on me.
2- giving a warning for CC takes away the surprise element of collisions for instance in sweeper one podium if I want to turn on collisions without the reds knowing as a surprise to kill off people I have to give a warning taking away the point of podium sweeper.
3-the previous vote to make this a rule had a very close call of 21:26

Poll is open for 5 days drop your ideas

 

[spoice]

all reds go stack on a single podium on sweeeperrrr

 

[$32]

Guys he didn't give a warning for collisions beat him with hammers!!!!!!!1111!

 

[hehe troll]

honestly, no

i personally don't think this rule needs to be changed.

the "surprise" element of collisions will result in (loads of) reds getting killed in the blink of an eye, and i think reds have to prepare for a sudden change in how a pretty important game mechanic works.

for example, imagine you're doing obby and are on a really small platform with another red, about to make the jump to the next platform when warden suddenly turns on collisions without warning. that'd screw up your jump, killing you because you weren't prepared for the collisions.
if the warden would've warned you: "cc turning on in 5 seconds", you could like, live. which would seem pretty useful to me idk

yeah that's my 2 cents do with this what you want

 

[Noirr]

lets make it even easier for the blu team to get rid of the entire red team, lovely suggestion no vote needed just let it go through. srsly tho this makes it too easy for blus AND might just end up in a failround most of the time anyway

 

[SirKrookodile]

the same reason cc needs a warning is the same as ff. Enabling it without warning can cause people to die unfairly. Since they lack the ability to react to it and adjust accordingly. Like if you have red team doing obby and you just randomly turn on cc, many people will get pushed off platforms and fall to their death.

 

[hehe troll]

the same reason cc needs a warning is the same as ff. Enabling it without warning can cause people to die unfairly. Since they lack the ability to react to it and adjust accordingly. Like if you have red team doing obby and you just randomly turn on cc, many people will get pushed off platforms and fall to their death.

basically what i said

 

[crubf]

"1-Many players don't know about this rule resulting in unnecessary reports like one that was made on me."

I don't understand why we need to edit rules around people who don't want to read them.

"2- giving a warning for CC takes away the surprise element of collisions"

This is...a good thing? It sucks shit to get killed by random CC toggles which is why the OG poll passed. If a minigame isnt killing reds fast enough find a different one or get creative.
CC surprise-toggling is lazy and sucks. If this passes it would probably not be very hard for me (or any other funny people) to remind people how bad this was.

 

[LilSpaceMan]

honestly, no

i personally don't think this rule needs to be changed.

the "surprise" element of collisions will result in (loads of) reds getting killed in the blink of an eye, and i think reds have to prepare for a sudden change in how a pretty important game mechanic works.

for example, imagine you're doing obby and are on a really small platform with another red, about to make the jump to the next platform when warden suddenly turns on collisions without warning. that'd screw up your jump, killing you because you weren't prepared for the collisions.
if the warden would've warned you: "cc turning on in 5 seconds", you could like, live. which would seem pretty useful to me idk

yeah that's my 2 cents do with this what you want

One of the main points I made was surprise factor and you don’t need a time limit just say cc gonna go on whenever

 

[_Black]

Hahahaha, no.

 

[Koduturott]

This seems dumb and useless. ​

 

[Cowboy]

Another suggestion for the sake of posting a suggestion

 

[Ian]

The more we edit these rules the less clear things become, the rule makes sense. Now think, wouldn't it be confusing for rules to constantly get implemented then reverted, if its constant, and our rules fluctuated less, It will overall lower this "confusion". I have a suspicion you just want a reason to play sweeper, and enable collisions with no warning with everyone on one podium.

 

[ThatFatPanda]

Doesn’t matter how many rules get changed, blus will always find ways to get bullied. And the reds will always think of more suggestions to have people do a poll on.

 

[VinnyTheSpy]

I guess having crits isnt enough

 

[koe]

The CC Warning prevents the unfairness in minigames like Bumble Beam, Sweeper, etc. and allows players to adjust accordingly so they aren't killed randomly because 'they should've just known it was gonna go on'
Not every player has the same mindset, not every player is going to know the rules and we should be setting a precedent to look out for said players so we don't have "unnecessary reports" coming in because you didn't just say "Im turning on collisions at X time".
I personally think this is another suggestion for the sake of bending the rules to how a person wants to have the game played for themselves, not thinking about how other players will react or what they think.

 

[hehe troll]

The CC Warning prevents the unfairness in minigames like Bumble Beam, Sweeper, etc. and allows players to adjust accordingly so they aren't killed randomly because 'they should've just known it was gonna go on'
Not every player has the same mindset, not every player is going to know the rules and we should be setting a precedent to look out for said players so we don't have "unnecessary reports" coming in because you didn't just say "Im turning on collisions at X time".
I personally think this is another suggestion for the sake of bending the rules to how a person wants to have the game played for themselves, not thinking about how other players will react or what they think.

honestly this is a great lesson for spaceman personally, to look out for what other people want and to look at their opinions.
not attacking him in any way, just saying, look out for others too

 

[Poacher]

I don't understand why we need to edit rules around people who don't want to read them.

I dare say that it’s less that people don’t want/will read the rules in a majority of cases and more so due to the fact that the current list of rules we have comes to 4512 words and I dare say that's a tad hard to remember.

It sucks shit to get killed by random CC toggles which is why the OG poll

It sucks shit to die first in 9 square than have to wait 5 minutes, the soccer ball randomly coming back towards you killing you, A scout hitting for 72 from a football fields length, getting random critted in HG/Cell wars, getting freekilled, die due to not picking up the star in starfield and the guy who got the car spawning in you, having to play soccer/bowling as soldier, having to play space jail, being singled out and killed in Death Run, Having to play any minigame you don’t like, having to play 9 crush, waiting for 10 minutes for a fail round HNS, having the warden give a time limit at a 50/50 in DR. I could go on but I feel like the point is made, dying Fucking sucks as a whole, things that you don’t like or get pissed at will always exist no matter what you do, CC is hardly an exception and unlike a majority of what I stated, CC is much more merciful due to being more skill reliant.

CC surprise-toggling is lazy and sucks

Like cellwars, meat grinder, “first to finish wins”, “play <minigame> all day” , wardens who play a RNG game everytime until one red, any warden who gives an impossible command like “complete speedrun backwards”, Plenty of shit is lazy, wanna ban these next

Another suggestion for the sake of posting a suggestion

Cuz it's a suggestion you don’t agree with it’s “for the sake of posting a suggestion”? You can make that comment for any somewhat debatable suggestion

the rule makes sense

It makes just as much sense for it the other way as well

wouldn't it be confusing for rules to constantly get implemented then reverted

Like I said, the rules word count is 4512 so I think things are already confusing enough for a new player, if a new player does make a mistake it should be the community’s job to correct them and it's not like we don’t have confusing rules (having to say elimination in trivia)/(first to finish implies you have to kill all other reds who didn’t finish first)

I have a suspicion you just want a reason to play sweeper, and enable collisions with no warning with everyone on one podium.

You could make the exact same claim that the original post was just Black not wanting to have to play one sweeper podium (both are true), obviously Space has his intents, but I don’t believe that this suggestion is only for that reason and CC still has uses outside of One sweeper Podium

The CC Warning prevents the unfairness in minigames like Bumble Beam, Sweeper, etc

1. Who goes into BB not expecting CC, this change literally doesn’t affect BB at all, it doesn’t matter if CC is on at the time or not, people will still be crouching/taunting no matter what
2. Sweeper is slightly the same case in the sense that, you should always be prepared for it anyway especially if you all are standing on one podium

allows players to adjust accordingly so they aren't killed randomly because 'they should've just known it was gonna go on'
Not every player has the same mindset, not every player is going to know the rules and we should be setting a precedent to look out for said players

IDK if this is a hot take or not, But I think CC takes skill to be good with it, whether it be intuition or actually not dying to it, and in competitions of skill, the more skilled player should win, we shouldn’t be balancing the gamemode for the worst of players.

honestly this is a great lesson for spaceman personally, to look out for what other people want and to look at their opinions.
not attacking him in any way, just saying, look out for others too

I want SS says back, but it didn’t so is the community not respecting my opinion? I want this suggestion to go through so does that mean i’m not respecting your opinion? What you, I, Spaceman, or any other JB player wants is different and how they choose to form their beliefs on JB is As well, I could make the claim that any person who made a suggestion I didn’t agree with was not looking out for my opinions or how I felt, whatever reason you want to believe for space making this suggestion is up to you,
But making the claim that him making this suggestion is not “looking out for others” is fucking stupid

Like I said when this change was accepted all this does is baby the game mode down and neuter’s a mechanic that wasn’t much of a problem to people who knew how to deal with CC

 

[Ian]

I dare say that it’s less that people don’t want/will read the rules in a majority of cases and more so due to the fact that the current list of rules we have comes to 4512 words and I dare say that's a tad hard to remember.



It sucks shit to die first in 9 square than have to wait 5 minutes, the soccer ball randomly coming back towards you killing you, A scout hitting for 72 from a football fields length, getting random critted in HG/Cell wars, getting freekilled, die due to not picking up the star in starfield and the guy who got the car spawning in you, having to play soccer/bowling as soldier, having to play space jail, being singled out and killed in Death Run, Having to play any minigame you don’t like, having to play 9 crush, waiting for 10 minutes for a fail round HNS, having the warden give a time limit at a 50/50 in DR. I could go on but I feel like the point is made, dying Fucking sucks as a whole, things that you don’t like or get pissed at will always exist no matter what you do, CC is hardly an exception and unlike a majority of what I stated, CC is much more merciful due to being more skill reliant.


Like cellwars, meat grinder, “first to finish wins”, “play <minigame> all day” , wardens who play a RNG game everytime until one red, any warden who gives an impossible command like “complete speedrun backwards”, Plenty of shit is lazy, wanna ban these next


Cuz it's a suggestion you don’t agree with it’s “for the sake of posting a suggestion”? You can make that comment for any somewhat debatable suggestion


It makes just as much sense for it the other way as well

Like I said, the rules word count is 4512 so I think things are already confusing enough for a new player, if a new player does make a mistake it should be the community’s job to correct them and it's not like we don’t have confusing rules (having to say elimination in trivia)/(first to finish implies you have to kill all other reds who didn’t finish first)

You could make the exact same claim that the original post was just Black not wanting to have to play one sweeper podium (both are true), obviously Space has his intents, but I don’t believe that this suggestion is only for that reason and CC still has uses outside of One sweeper Podium

1. Who goes into BB not expecting CC, this change literally doesn’t affect BB at all, it doesn’t matter if CC is on at the time or not, people will still be crouching/taunting no matter what
2. Sweeper is slightly the same case in the sense that, you should always be prepared for it anyway especially if you all are standing on one podium

IDK if this is a hot take or not, But I think CC takes skill to be good with it, whether it be intuition or actually not dying to it, and in competitions of skill, the more skilled player should win, we shouldn’t be balancing the gamemode for the worst of players.

I want SS says back, but it didn’t so is the community not respecting my opinion? I want this suggestion to go through so does that mean i’m not respecting your opinion? What you, I, Spaceman, or any other JB player wants is different and how they choose to form their beliefs on JB is As well, I could make the claim that any person who made a suggestion I didn’t agree with was not looking out for my opinions or how I felt, whatever reason you want to believe for space making this suggestion is up to you,
But making the claim that him making this suggestion is not “looking out for others” is fucking stupid

Like I said when this change was accepted all this does is baby the game mode down and neuter’s a mechanic that wasn’t much of a problem to people who knew how to deal with CC

Thank you for speaking, I was having a hard time grasping the other argument because other explanations felt hollow or too much like a joke for me to determine their seriousness. About your replies I will further elaborate on my perspectives. The rule makes sense was a misguiding word choice meant to get a response with its lack of description. I personally prefer the rule as it is homogeneous to a a set of rules of similar nature (ff announcements/game announcements, and similar) with a simple goal to protect reds from bullshit. From a fresh new standpoint I believe having rules that are similar for similar situations is helpful for new players too. Although I see your point of it already being confusing and difficult to remember. I have always been for the most part a proponent of less is more and only really made rule suggestions recently with 2 goals 1. outline a larger issue, or 2. to fix a major problem, so unless the suggestion offers to fix a problem I don’t see it as worth the breath. Our rule set is too long to be honest, I will acknowledge that. Oh and also I was poking fun at space with that last bit about sweeper one podium.

 

[crubf]

I dare say that it’s less that people don’t want/will read the rules in a majority of cases and more so due to the fact that the current list of rules we have comes to 4512 words and I dare say that's a tad hard to remember.

Because Jailbreak is a roleplaying game mode with much different rules of engagement than what practically any other game mode in TF2 requires out of you, the rules list is particularly long. That is correct. You can technically get by without reading them but if you are going to be on the team that requires you to know how to play your role it's expected that you understand what it is. If you are aware you need to know the rules to play on the guard team, don't read the rules, then play guard anyways it is not our problem nor should it be anyone else's. We shouldn't cater to people who don't care.

"It sucks shit to die first in 9 square[...]"

It is an unfortunate circumstance that certain specific games have RNG or wonky physics that can wind up being unintentional RNG but that's not a reason for why every other game also needs to have RNG. You go into 9 square knowing you'll probably not get lucky, which is why it's not a very popular minigame among regulars. Sweeper doesn't come attached with the knowledge that at any moment a single button press in the warden menu can result in you getting pushed off without you actually doing anything wrong.
Just because some games require randomness to win doesn't mean we should make it so ALL games require randomness to win.